Is honey really a supersaturated solution? Does heating to un-crystalize redissolve it or melt it?












3












$begingroup$


In the SciShow video Honey: Bacteria's Worst Enemy after about 00:30 the narrator says:




Honey is only about 17% water. Most, but not all of what remains is sugar. The two main types of sugar in honey are glucose and fructose. Like all sugars, glucose and fructose are sticky — they attract water.



Honey is technically a supersaturated solution, meaning it contains more sugar than would normally dissolve at that temperature. That’s why it eventually gets all crystally in the pantry — over time, sugar comes out of the solution.




In my experience when old honey "gets all crystally in the pantry" I've placed the jar in a hot water bath, and eventually the honey's viscous liquidy consistency is restored.



When I do this, am I redissolving the sugar, or melting it?



I'm asking because even hot, with only 17% water it's hard to imagine it can become an unsaturated solution.










share|improve this question











$endgroup$

















    3












    $begingroup$


    In the SciShow video Honey: Bacteria's Worst Enemy after about 00:30 the narrator says:




    Honey is only about 17% water. Most, but not all of what remains is sugar. The two main types of sugar in honey are glucose and fructose. Like all sugars, glucose and fructose are sticky — they attract water.



    Honey is technically a supersaturated solution, meaning it contains more sugar than would normally dissolve at that temperature. That’s why it eventually gets all crystally in the pantry — over time, sugar comes out of the solution.




    In my experience when old honey "gets all crystally in the pantry" I've placed the jar in a hot water bath, and eventually the honey's viscous liquidy consistency is restored.



    When I do this, am I redissolving the sugar, or melting it?



    I'm asking because even hot, with only 17% water it's hard to imagine it can become an unsaturated solution.










    share|improve this question











    $endgroup$















      3












      3








      3





      $begingroup$


      In the SciShow video Honey: Bacteria's Worst Enemy after about 00:30 the narrator says:




      Honey is only about 17% water. Most, but not all of what remains is sugar. The two main types of sugar in honey are glucose and fructose. Like all sugars, glucose and fructose are sticky — they attract water.



      Honey is technically a supersaturated solution, meaning it contains more sugar than would normally dissolve at that temperature. That’s why it eventually gets all crystally in the pantry — over time, sugar comes out of the solution.




      In my experience when old honey "gets all crystally in the pantry" I've placed the jar in a hot water bath, and eventually the honey's viscous liquidy consistency is restored.



      When I do this, am I redissolving the sugar, or melting it?



      I'm asking because even hot, with only 17% water it's hard to imagine it can become an unsaturated solution.










      share|improve this question











      $endgroup$




      In the SciShow video Honey: Bacteria's Worst Enemy after about 00:30 the narrator says:




      Honey is only about 17% water. Most, but not all of what remains is sugar. The two main types of sugar in honey are glucose and fructose. Like all sugars, glucose and fructose are sticky — they attract water.



      Honey is technically a supersaturated solution, meaning it contains more sugar than would normally dissolve at that temperature. That’s why it eventually gets all crystally in the pantry — over time, sugar comes out of the solution.




      In my experience when old honey "gets all crystally in the pantry" I've placed the jar in a hot water bath, and eventually the honey's viscous liquidy consistency is restored.



      When I do this, am I redissolving the sugar, or melting it?



      I'm asking because even hot, with only 17% water it's hard to imagine it can become an unsaturated solution.







      everyday-chemistry solubility melting-point recrystallization viscosity






      share|improve this question















      share|improve this question













      share|improve this question




      share|improve this question








      edited 2 hours ago







      uhoh

















      asked 3 hours ago









      uhohuhoh

      1,513836




      1,513836






















          2 Answers
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          active

          oldest

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          3












          $begingroup$

          Melting and dissolving are all the same when you look at mixtures close to saturation.



          You can say water lowers the melting point of the sugar, or that the solubility of sugar increases with temperature. Different description, same fact.






          share|improve this answer









          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            Is this a general principle in chemistry (for supersaturated solutions), or does it mostly apply to saturated solutions of sugar?
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago








          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I would call it a non-principle. ;-) If you think about a saltwater solution, you would clearly use the word "solubility". There's a large miscibility gap. Molten sugar and water however are completely miscible, the Bp of one and Mp of the other are closeby.
            $endgroup$
            – Karl
            1 hour ago



















          3












          $begingroup$

          Honey is indeed a complex mixture containing more than hundred compounds.



          As for Wikipedia and depending on the point of view it is a




          • supersatured liquid solution


          • supercooled liquid (in the sense that can get so viscous to appear solid, without affecting its status of being a supersatured solution, and undergoes glass transition).



          https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honey#Physical_and_chemical_properties



          The facts that you describe in the Q are less surprising if we consider that




          • with respect to sugars crystallization, of which at least there are two different ones, glucose and fructose, the rest of the non-sugar components must be considered as impurities;


          • impurities, even in traces, often hamper the crystallisation of a compound, even in simple mixture of a single compound and the above traces. This is common after organic synthesis, in which an "oil" is attained that might crystallize only upon prolonged storage or a careful removal of the disturbing trace compound(s);


          • finally and most important, the solubility of sugars in water is very high, and very sensitive to T. For instance, already at room temperature glucose is soluble in the reason of 90 g per 100 ml of water, that means a saturated solution contains already about fifty percent w/w of sugar.



          A table is here (I didn't cross checked the values):



          http://www.mpcfaculty.net/mark_bishop/supersaturated.htm



          This makes the attainment of a supersatured solution particularly easy, as in the kitchen in the case of sucrose:



          https://sciencing.com/make-supersaturated-solution-sugar-6199355.html



          As such, heating crystallized honey does indeed dissolve sugars, and a supersaturated solution is attained upon subsequent cooling






          share|improve this answer











          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            okay I"m going to have to take some time to read these, thanks!
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago











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          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

          votes








          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

          votes









          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

          votes









          3












          $begingroup$

          Melting and dissolving are all the same when you look at mixtures close to saturation.



          You can say water lowers the melting point of the sugar, or that the solubility of sugar increases with temperature. Different description, same fact.






          share|improve this answer









          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            Is this a general principle in chemistry (for supersaturated solutions), or does it mostly apply to saturated solutions of sugar?
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago








          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I would call it a non-principle. ;-) If you think about a saltwater solution, you would clearly use the word "solubility". There's a large miscibility gap. Molten sugar and water however are completely miscible, the Bp of one and Mp of the other are closeby.
            $endgroup$
            – Karl
            1 hour ago
















          3












          $begingroup$

          Melting and dissolving are all the same when you look at mixtures close to saturation.



          You can say water lowers the melting point of the sugar, or that the solubility of sugar increases with temperature. Different description, same fact.






          share|improve this answer









          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            Is this a general principle in chemistry (for supersaturated solutions), or does it mostly apply to saturated solutions of sugar?
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago








          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I would call it a non-principle. ;-) If you think about a saltwater solution, you would clearly use the word "solubility". There's a large miscibility gap. Molten sugar and water however are completely miscible, the Bp of one and Mp of the other are closeby.
            $endgroup$
            – Karl
            1 hour ago














          3












          3








          3





          $begingroup$

          Melting and dissolving are all the same when you look at mixtures close to saturation.



          You can say water lowers the melting point of the sugar, or that the solubility of sugar increases with temperature. Different description, same fact.






          share|improve this answer









          $endgroup$



          Melting and dissolving are all the same when you look at mixtures close to saturation.



          You can say water lowers the melting point of the sugar, or that the solubility of sugar increases with temperature. Different description, same fact.







          share|improve this answer












          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered 2 hours ago









          KarlKarl

          6,0441432




          6,0441432












          • $begingroup$
            Is this a general principle in chemistry (for supersaturated solutions), or does it mostly apply to saturated solutions of sugar?
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago








          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I would call it a non-principle. ;-) If you think about a saltwater solution, you would clearly use the word "solubility". There's a large miscibility gap. Molten sugar and water however are completely miscible, the Bp of one and Mp of the other are closeby.
            $endgroup$
            – Karl
            1 hour ago


















          • $begingroup$
            Is this a general principle in chemistry (for supersaturated solutions), or does it mostly apply to saturated solutions of sugar?
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago








          • 1




            $begingroup$
            I would call it a non-principle. ;-) If you think about a saltwater solution, you would clearly use the word "solubility". There's a large miscibility gap. Molten sugar and water however are completely miscible, the Bp of one and Mp of the other are closeby.
            $endgroup$
            – Karl
            1 hour ago
















          $begingroup$
          Is this a general principle in chemistry (for supersaturated solutions), or does it mostly apply to saturated solutions of sugar?
          $endgroup$
          – uhoh
          1 hour ago






          $begingroup$
          Is this a general principle in chemistry (for supersaturated solutions), or does it mostly apply to saturated solutions of sugar?
          $endgroup$
          – uhoh
          1 hour ago






          1




          1




          $begingroup$
          I would call it a non-principle. ;-) If you think about a saltwater solution, you would clearly use the word "solubility". There's a large miscibility gap. Molten sugar and water however are completely miscible, the Bp of one and Mp of the other are closeby.
          $endgroup$
          – Karl
          1 hour ago




          $begingroup$
          I would call it a non-principle. ;-) If you think about a saltwater solution, you would clearly use the word "solubility". There's a large miscibility gap. Molten sugar and water however are completely miscible, the Bp of one and Mp of the other are closeby.
          $endgroup$
          – Karl
          1 hour ago











          3












          $begingroup$

          Honey is indeed a complex mixture containing more than hundred compounds.



          As for Wikipedia and depending on the point of view it is a




          • supersatured liquid solution


          • supercooled liquid (in the sense that can get so viscous to appear solid, without affecting its status of being a supersatured solution, and undergoes glass transition).



          https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honey#Physical_and_chemical_properties



          The facts that you describe in the Q are less surprising if we consider that




          • with respect to sugars crystallization, of which at least there are two different ones, glucose and fructose, the rest of the non-sugar components must be considered as impurities;


          • impurities, even in traces, often hamper the crystallisation of a compound, even in simple mixture of a single compound and the above traces. This is common after organic synthesis, in which an "oil" is attained that might crystallize only upon prolonged storage or a careful removal of the disturbing trace compound(s);


          • finally and most important, the solubility of sugars in water is very high, and very sensitive to T. For instance, already at room temperature glucose is soluble in the reason of 90 g per 100 ml of water, that means a saturated solution contains already about fifty percent w/w of sugar.



          A table is here (I didn't cross checked the values):



          http://www.mpcfaculty.net/mark_bishop/supersaturated.htm



          This makes the attainment of a supersatured solution particularly easy, as in the kitchen in the case of sucrose:



          https://sciencing.com/make-supersaturated-solution-sugar-6199355.html



          As such, heating crystallized honey does indeed dissolve sugars, and a supersaturated solution is attained upon subsequent cooling






          share|improve this answer











          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            okay I"m going to have to take some time to read these, thanks!
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago
















          3












          $begingroup$

          Honey is indeed a complex mixture containing more than hundred compounds.



          As for Wikipedia and depending on the point of view it is a




          • supersatured liquid solution


          • supercooled liquid (in the sense that can get so viscous to appear solid, without affecting its status of being a supersatured solution, and undergoes glass transition).



          https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honey#Physical_and_chemical_properties



          The facts that you describe in the Q are less surprising if we consider that




          • with respect to sugars crystallization, of which at least there are two different ones, glucose and fructose, the rest of the non-sugar components must be considered as impurities;


          • impurities, even in traces, often hamper the crystallisation of a compound, even in simple mixture of a single compound and the above traces. This is common after organic synthesis, in which an "oil" is attained that might crystallize only upon prolonged storage or a careful removal of the disturbing trace compound(s);


          • finally and most important, the solubility of sugars in water is very high, and very sensitive to T. For instance, already at room temperature glucose is soluble in the reason of 90 g per 100 ml of water, that means a saturated solution contains already about fifty percent w/w of sugar.



          A table is here (I didn't cross checked the values):



          http://www.mpcfaculty.net/mark_bishop/supersaturated.htm



          This makes the attainment of a supersatured solution particularly easy, as in the kitchen in the case of sucrose:



          https://sciencing.com/make-supersaturated-solution-sugar-6199355.html



          As such, heating crystallized honey does indeed dissolve sugars, and a supersaturated solution is attained upon subsequent cooling






          share|improve this answer











          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            okay I"m going to have to take some time to read these, thanks!
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago














          3












          3








          3





          $begingroup$

          Honey is indeed a complex mixture containing more than hundred compounds.



          As for Wikipedia and depending on the point of view it is a




          • supersatured liquid solution


          • supercooled liquid (in the sense that can get so viscous to appear solid, without affecting its status of being a supersatured solution, and undergoes glass transition).



          https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honey#Physical_and_chemical_properties



          The facts that you describe in the Q are less surprising if we consider that




          • with respect to sugars crystallization, of which at least there are two different ones, glucose and fructose, the rest of the non-sugar components must be considered as impurities;


          • impurities, even in traces, often hamper the crystallisation of a compound, even in simple mixture of a single compound and the above traces. This is common after organic synthesis, in which an "oil" is attained that might crystallize only upon prolonged storage or a careful removal of the disturbing trace compound(s);


          • finally and most important, the solubility of sugars in water is very high, and very sensitive to T. For instance, already at room temperature glucose is soluble in the reason of 90 g per 100 ml of water, that means a saturated solution contains already about fifty percent w/w of sugar.



          A table is here (I didn't cross checked the values):



          http://www.mpcfaculty.net/mark_bishop/supersaturated.htm



          This makes the attainment of a supersatured solution particularly easy, as in the kitchen in the case of sucrose:



          https://sciencing.com/make-supersaturated-solution-sugar-6199355.html



          As such, heating crystallized honey does indeed dissolve sugars, and a supersaturated solution is attained upon subsequent cooling






          share|improve this answer











          $endgroup$



          Honey is indeed a complex mixture containing more than hundred compounds.



          As for Wikipedia and depending on the point of view it is a




          • supersatured liquid solution


          • supercooled liquid (in the sense that can get so viscous to appear solid, without affecting its status of being a supersatured solution, and undergoes glass transition).



          https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honey#Physical_and_chemical_properties



          The facts that you describe in the Q are less surprising if we consider that




          • with respect to sugars crystallization, of which at least there are two different ones, glucose and fructose, the rest of the non-sugar components must be considered as impurities;


          • impurities, even in traces, often hamper the crystallisation of a compound, even in simple mixture of a single compound and the above traces. This is common after organic synthesis, in which an "oil" is attained that might crystallize only upon prolonged storage or a careful removal of the disturbing trace compound(s);


          • finally and most important, the solubility of sugars in water is very high, and very sensitive to T. For instance, already at room temperature glucose is soluble in the reason of 90 g per 100 ml of water, that means a saturated solution contains already about fifty percent w/w of sugar.



          A table is here (I didn't cross checked the values):



          http://www.mpcfaculty.net/mark_bishop/supersaturated.htm



          This makes the attainment of a supersatured solution particularly easy, as in the kitchen in the case of sucrose:



          https://sciencing.com/make-supersaturated-solution-sugar-6199355.html



          As such, heating crystallized honey does indeed dissolve sugars, and a supersaturated solution is attained upon subsequent cooling







          share|improve this answer














          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer








          edited 1 hour ago

























          answered 1 hour ago









          AlchimistaAlchimista

          1,67738




          1,67738












          • $begingroup$
            okay I"m going to have to take some time to read these, thanks!
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago


















          • $begingroup$
            okay I"m going to have to take some time to read these, thanks!
            $endgroup$
            – uhoh
            1 hour ago
















          $begingroup$
          okay I"m going to have to take some time to read these, thanks!
          $endgroup$
          – uhoh
          1 hour ago




          $begingroup$
          okay I"m going to have to take some time to read these, thanks!
          $endgroup$
          – uhoh
          1 hour ago


















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