Gemara word for QED












1















I'm trying to remember the Gemara word for the equivalent of QED, when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue.










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  • 1





    Maybe קא משמע לן?

    – Double AA
    6 hours ago






  • 2





    שמע מינה? תיובתא?

    – robev
    6 hours ago


















1















I'm trying to remember the Gemara word for the equivalent of QED, when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue.










share|improve this question









New contributor




gomisha is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
















  • 1





    Maybe קא משמע לן?

    – Double AA
    6 hours ago






  • 2





    שמע מינה? תיובתא?

    – robev
    6 hours ago
















1












1








1








I'm trying to remember the Gemara word for the equivalent of QED, when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue.










share|improve this question









New contributor




gomisha is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.












I'm trying to remember the Gemara word for the equivalent of QED, when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue.







words talmud-gemara






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gomisha is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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gomisha is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.









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edited 6 hours ago









Alex

21.8k153128




21.8k153128






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asked 6 hours ago









gomishagomisha

1061




1061




New contributor




gomisha is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.





New contributor





gomisha is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.






gomisha is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.








  • 1





    Maybe קא משמע לן?

    – Double AA
    6 hours ago






  • 2





    שמע מינה? תיובתא?

    – robev
    6 hours ago
















  • 1





    Maybe קא משמע לן?

    – Double AA
    6 hours ago






  • 2





    שמע מינה? תיובתא?

    – robev
    6 hours ago










1




1





Maybe קא משמע לן?

– Double AA
6 hours ago





Maybe קא משמע לן?

– Double AA
6 hours ago




2




2





שמע מינה? תיובתא?

– robev
6 hours ago







שמע מינה? תיובתא?

– robev
6 hours ago












3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















3














You might be thinking of the word תיובתא as, for example, in Berachot 10b:




תיובתא דרב חסדא תיובתא



Is not this a refutation of R. Hisda? It is [indeed] a refutation. (Soncino translation)




As explained by several rishonim, e.g. Rashbam to Bava Batra 52b:




כל היכא דאמר בגמ' תיובתא דפלוני תיובתא בטלו דברי מי שהתיובתא עליו לגמרי



Anywhere that the Talmud says "Is not this a refutation of So-And-So? It is [indeed] a refutation", the words of he whom the refutation is upon are entirely rejected.




While this would be an official end to the discussion, it does not necessarily carry the same connotation of a rigorous logical/mathematical proof that QED would.






share|improve this answer
























  • תיובתא is always a refutation. It's not used generally when proving something.

    – Daniel
    2 hours ago











  • @Daniel I was going on the wording of “when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue”.

    – Alex
    1 hour ago



















2














I believe the word you are looking for is שמע מינה (we can [learn] from here). שמע מינה is often used when the Gemara asks for a proof to certain statement. If the Gemara brings a sastifying proof to something, it may end off by saying




.שמע מינה [like this statement] ,שמע מינה




It is basically saying we can learn out this statement from this proof, much like Q.E.D., it has been proven.



However, שמע מינה isn't only used to prove statements. It is also used in an attempt to prove a statement, before the actual proof is said. In that case it is more like saying let us try to learn from here. However, overall I would say that's definitely the word you are looking for.






share|improve this answer
























  • Right answer. .

    – kouty
    1 hour ago



















2














I suspect that the phrase you're thinking of is קא משמע לן (ka mashma lan). It's not exactly QED, but it's often used similarly.



A typical usage that's most similar to Q.E.D. would be: "We would have thought X but Y therefore Z. Ka mashma lan."






share|improve this answer































    3 Answers
    3






    active

    oldest

    votes








    3 Answers
    3






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    3














    You might be thinking of the word תיובתא as, for example, in Berachot 10b:




    תיובתא דרב חסדא תיובתא



    Is not this a refutation of R. Hisda? It is [indeed] a refutation. (Soncino translation)




    As explained by several rishonim, e.g. Rashbam to Bava Batra 52b:




    כל היכא דאמר בגמ' תיובתא דפלוני תיובתא בטלו דברי מי שהתיובתא עליו לגמרי



    Anywhere that the Talmud says "Is not this a refutation of So-And-So? It is [indeed] a refutation", the words of he whom the refutation is upon are entirely rejected.




    While this would be an official end to the discussion, it does not necessarily carry the same connotation of a rigorous logical/mathematical proof that QED would.






    share|improve this answer
























    • תיובתא is always a refutation. It's not used generally when proving something.

      – Daniel
      2 hours ago











    • @Daniel I was going on the wording of “when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue”.

      – Alex
      1 hour ago
















    3














    You might be thinking of the word תיובתא as, for example, in Berachot 10b:




    תיובתא דרב חסדא תיובתא



    Is not this a refutation of R. Hisda? It is [indeed] a refutation. (Soncino translation)




    As explained by several rishonim, e.g. Rashbam to Bava Batra 52b:




    כל היכא דאמר בגמ' תיובתא דפלוני תיובתא בטלו דברי מי שהתיובתא עליו לגמרי



    Anywhere that the Talmud says "Is not this a refutation of So-And-So? It is [indeed] a refutation", the words of he whom the refutation is upon are entirely rejected.




    While this would be an official end to the discussion, it does not necessarily carry the same connotation of a rigorous logical/mathematical proof that QED would.






    share|improve this answer
























    • תיובתא is always a refutation. It's not used generally when proving something.

      – Daniel
      2 hours ago











    • @Daniel I was going on the wording of “when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue”.

      – Alex
      1 hour ago














    3












    3








    3







    You might be thinking of the word תיובתא as, for example, in Berachot 10b:




    תיובתא דרב חסדא תיובתא



    Is not this a refutation of R. Hisda? It is [indeed] a refutation. (Soncino translation)




    As explained by several rishonim, e.g. Rashbam to Bava Batra 52b:




    כל היכא דאמר בגמ' תיובתא דפלוני תיובתא בטלו דברי מי שהתיובתא עליו לגמרי



    Anywhere that the Talmud says "Is not this a refutation of So-And-So? It is [indeed] a refutation", the words of he whom the refutation is upon are entirely rejected.




    While this would be an official end to the discussion, it does not necessarily carry the same connotation of a rigorous logical/mathematical proof that QED would.






    share|improve this answer













    You might be thinking of the word תיובתא as, for example, in Berachot 10b:




    תיובתא דרב חסדא תיובתא



    Is not this a refutation of R. Hisda? It is [indeed] a refutation. (Soncino translation)




    As explained by several rishonim, e.g. Rashbam to Bava Batra 52b:




    כל היכא דאמר בגמ' תיובתא דפלוני תיובתא בטלו דברי מי שהתיובתא עליו לגמרי



    Anywhere that the Talmud says "Is not this a refutation of So-And-So? It is [indeed] a refutation", the words of he whom the refutation is upon are entirely rejected.




    While this would be an official end to the discussion, it does not necessarily carry the same connotation of a rigorous logical/mathematical proof that QED would.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered 6 hours ago









    AlexAlex

    21.8k153128




    21.8k153128













    • תיובתא is always a refutation. It's not used generally when proving something.

      – Daniel
      2 hours ago











    • @Daniel I was going on the wording of “when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue”.

      – Alex
      1 hour ago



















    • תיובתא is always a refutation. It's not used generally when proving something.

      – Daniel
      2 hours ago











    • @Daniel I was going on the wording of “when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue”.

      – Alex
      1 hour ago

















    תיובתא is always a refutation. It's not used generally when proving something.

    – Daniel
    2 hours ago





    תיובתא is always a refutation. It's not used generally when proving something.

    – Daniel
    2 hours ago













    @Daniel I was going on the wording of “when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue”.

    – Alex
    1 hour ago





    @Daniel I was going on the wording of “when an argument would be settled between competing opinions and nothing more would be said about the issue”.

    – Alex
    1 hour ago











    2














    I believe the word you are looking for is שמע מינה (we can [learn] from here). שמע מינה is often used when the Gemara asks for a proof to certain statement. If the Gemara brings a sastifying proof to something, it may end off by saying




    .שמע מינה [like this statement] ,שמע מינה




    It is basically saying we can learn out this statement from this proof, much like Q.E.D., it has been proven.



    However, שמע מינה isn't only used to prove statements. It is also used in an attempt to prove a statement, before the actual proof is said. In that case it is more like saying let us try to learn from here. However, overall I would say that's definitely the word you are looking for.






    share|improve this answer
























    • Right answer. .

      – kouty
      1 hour ago
















    2














    I believe the word you are looking for is שמע מינה (we can [learn] from here). שמע מינה is often used when the Gemara asks for a proof to certain statement. If the Gemara brings a sastifying proof to something, it may end off by saying




    .שמע מינה [like this statement] ,שמע מינה




    It is basically saying we can learn out this statement from this proof, much like Q.E.D., it has been proven.



    However, שמע מינה isn't only used to prove statements. It is also used in an attempt to prove a statement, before the actual proof is said. In that case it is more like saying let us try to learn from here. However, overall I would say that's definitely the word you are looking for.






    share|improve this answer
























    • Right answer. .

      – kouty
      1 hour ago














    2












    2








    2







    I believe the word you are looking for is שמע מינה (we can [learn] from here). שמע מינה is often used when the Gemara asks for a proof to certain statement. If the Gemara brings a sastifying proof to something, it may end off by saying




    .שמע מינה [like this statement] ,שמע מינה




    It is basically saying we can learn out this statement from this proof, much like Q.E.D., it has been proven.



    However, שמע מינה isn't only used to prove statements. It is also used in an attempt to prove a statement, before the actual proof is said. In that case it is more like saying let us try to learn from here. However, overall I would say that's definitely the word you are looking for.






    share|improve this answer













    I believe the word you are looking for is שמע מינה (we can [learn] from here). שמע מינה is often used when the Gemara asks for a proof to certain statement. If the Gemara brings a sastifying proof to something, it may end off by saying




    .שמע מינה [like this statement] ,שמע מינה




    It is basically saying we can learn out this statement from this proof, much like Q.E.D., it has been proven.



    However, שמע מינה isn't only used to prove statements. It is also used in an attempt to prove a statement, before the actual proof is said. In that case it is more like saying let us try to learn from here. However, overall I would say that's definitely the word you are looking for.







    share|improve this answer












    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer










    answered 3 hours ago









    RafaelRafael

    436113




    436113













    • Right answer. .

      – kouty
      1 hour ago



















    • Right answer. .

      – kouty
      1 hour ago

















    Right answer. .

    – kouty
    1 hour ago





    Right answer. .

    – kouty
    1 hour ago











    2














    I suspect that the phrase you're thinking of is קא משמע לן (ka mashma lan). It's not exactly QED, but it's often used similarly.



    A typical usage that's most similar to Q.E.D. would be: "We would have thought X but Y therefore Z. Ka mashma lan."






    share|improve this answer




























      2














      I suspect that the phrase you're thinking of is קא משמע לן (ka mashma lan). It's not exactly QED, but it's often used similarly.



      A typical usage that's most similar to Q.E.D. would be: "We would have thought X but Y therefore Z. Ka mashma lan."






      share|improve this answer


























        2












        2








        2







        I suspect that the phrase you're thinking of is קא משמע לן (ka mashma lan). It's not exactly QED, but it's often used similarly.



        A typical usage that's most similar to Q.E.D. would be: "We would have thought X but Y therefore Z. Ka mashma lan."






        share|improve this answer













        I suspect that the phrase you're thinking of is קא משמע לן (ka mashma lan). It's not exactly QED, but it's often used similarly.



        A typical usage that's most similar to Q.E.D. would be: "We would have thought X but Y therefore Z. Ka mashma lan."







        share|improve this answer












        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer










        answered 2 hours ago









        DanielDaniel

        15.3k231109




        15.3k231109















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